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My head *not* being up my ass doesn't mean I know where it *is*. Clue?
polydad
Ordinarily I'm fairly introspective. Right now I'm finding that difficult for some reason, so I think I'll try explaining me to *you* rather than me, and see if that helps.

Yesterday I spent at the HCAO (Health Care for All Oregon) annual statewide meeting, at which I got reminded that I'd volunteered to do some database work for them, which I had forgotten. Fortunately the account data for their database was still on my laptop, so I could log in and take a look at what they had. While they do have a lot of DB problems, the underlying problem is that they have never really known what they're doing, and all the people involved in the DB work are amateurs, and so have no idea of what they could or should be doing, and so the *data* is a near-complete mess. Coming up with better ways to manipulate already-known-to-be-bad data will *not* make it better.

Other than that, it was mostly a waste of a day, in that they spent it telling me and each other with great enthusiasm how good an idea single-payer health care is, which everyone in the room already agreed upon. So it was mostly a cheerleading session, which I can tolerate well but doesn't do anything for me. Sorta like babysitting a toddler who's obsessed with playing with blocks, and has a nice set of blocks to play with -- I have to stay in the room and keep watch, but the kid's happily amused and not bothering anybody.

I'm involved with HCAO in the first place because a few years ago I'd hit on the idea of being personally involved with at least one organization pursuing each identified basic need of civilization. Health care is one such need; I have a list on this machine somewhere of about 17 I've identified so far. Air, water, food, shelter, security, and medical care start it off.

For tactical (and thus easily dismissable) reasons, the three ventures I've recently been most involved with are a Housing and a Representation project, XCRH and Civic Consul respectively, and Metaculture, which is an indirect project, a tool that both of the above have great use for.

I've been reading David Deutsch's "The Beginnings of Infinity" recently, and find it has a lot of applicability to both Metaculture and Civic Consul, and to a lesser extent XCRH. It's also a very "busy" book; there's a lot going on it that's neat and interesting and *not* related to any immediate practical use I have for it. I think I need to do a chapter-by-chapter summary of it before I continue -- I'm on chapter six of 18 -- so I can keep track of which chapters I have use for, and hold on to Deutsch's train of thought 'til I get to the end of the book and can figure out what he's trying to accomplish. I don't yet know where he's going with this, and so can't figure out if *his* point is something I have use for.

Deutsch reads like a geek who has invented a marvelously elaborate tool of which he is very proud, and wants everyone to admire it. In the process of so doing, he has invented a number of contributory tools I am finding very useful in *my* work, which is good for me even if his Grand Opus turns out to be a glorified whirligig. Chapter Six deals with a number of models of infinity, which may be useful to *his* point but don't do anything for *me*.

An online flirtation I'd been involved with also seems to be involved here, but I can't yet tell how or why. I use the past tense because it now seems my nominal inamorata was simply a con artist trying to get me to send money. I was willing to be stung for a few bucks to keep the action going, but then devised a way to enforce third-party verification before sending any more, and the conversation abruptly ceased. That was yesterday morning; it's still not impossible that my correspondent is simply stupid rather than dishonest, and might continue the conversation. I *doubt* it, but as said, not impossible.

And also as said, I don't know *why* that flirtation is relevant here. To speculate, it may take a lot of emotional “energy” on my part to stay emotionally involved with a concept as abstract as metaculture, and I may have been getting some of that from the thoughts of my flirtation. Hmm, that may have some truth in it, but if so, it’s incomplete, because Deutsch's book is also a part of this, and that explanation doesn’t account for Deutsch.

Deutsch's subtitle is “Explanations that transform the world”, and I think his explanations *are* transformative, but I haven’t yet figured out what he’s trying to transform to what-else, or why. I suspect his purpose and mine are overlapping Venn-sets, and that it’s taking yet *more* energy to only take out of his work what’s good and useful to *me* without being shanghai’d off on *his* as-yet-unidentified crusade.

So those are two purposes for which I have use of inexactly-defined emotional energy, and one abortive source for such energy. I have a couple of other sources for such energy which don’t seem to be easily adapted to either of these particular purposes. And I haven’t as yet generated a model of emotional ‘energy’ of sufficient complexity to be of use to me here. Maybe I need to go work on one. Unless you happen to have one handy you’d care to share?


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I sure do hear you about 'cheerleading sessions'! "If we all agree about this, why do we have to keep talking about it?" No doubt it's a neurotypical thing.

Aaagh, 'flirtation' - important rule of thumb here: if you are paying, or being asked to pay, for the lady's favors, it is not a flirtation. It is not a romance, nor is it ever going to be one. It is certainly nothing resembling a 'relationship'. What it is, is sex work - a professional transaction, not a personal one.

If it's any consolation, James just got scammed in a similar way, and he's probably going to lose even more money for nothing, because he is unable or unwilling to grok this basic concept, and keeps hoping the 'model' who's stringing him along will actually show up and be nice to him. She never will, but whatever; it's his own money to waste. Note that I totally approve of his hiring a prostitute; I just wish he'd find an honest one, viz. one who will give him good value for her fee. "Don't pay the ferryman", right?

I don't really see how even a genuine flirtation online would be a source of emotional energy. Rather, it seems to me it would consume emotional energy - starting a new relationship is an incredibly spoon-intensive undertaking, and unless one has spoons to burn, other aspects of one's life generally get neglected.

To be perfectly (maybe excessively) honest, the whole metaculture thing seems like wank to me - another fascinatingly complex, abstruse Game To Play With Your Head that is not related to any practical use whatsoever. You might just as well spend your spoons teaching yourself Enochian, for all the good it will ever do you or anyone else.

Of course, if you enjoy it, that's another matter - "de gustibus est non disputandem"; I have a bunch of hobbies myself, that are of no practical use except that they amuse me - but if it's consuming rather than restoring your spoons, you might want to take another look at just why you're doing this.

For me, emotional energy comes primarily from engagement with the natural world. I like people too, and I do sometimes gain emotional energy from human interaction, but mostly, dealing with people burns spoons rather than restoring them. This is not a bad thing - it's like burning calories, right? As long as the energy coming in equals the energy going out, balance is maintained. I spend a great deal of time out in the Wild alone, and thus have sufficient spoons for dealing with my folk, chatting online, reading complex books, and otherwise engaging with the world of human communication.

Emotional energy may work quite differently for you. I note that you're willing to go out in the Wild (which is more than can be said for a lot of my friends!) but you don't seem to gain spoons from it - rather the reverse, I thought - and you don't seem to view it as an alternative to human communication, but rather, as just another platform for it. I could be wrong, but I don't really picture you going out in the Wild by yourself, just to experience it with your senses and stop thinking in words for a while.

*grins* So, that's probably not a lot of help, but it's all I gots this morning. Hope you're having a beautiful day! *hugs*

My cardiac issues seem to have strongly affected my relationships with the Wild. I now notice myself paying more attention to "Do I have enough oxygen to complete this effort?" than nonverbal "Look at that!"'s.

It's true that, for example, during our trip out on the Spit I was paying more attention to *you* than to the surroundings. I have a quandary surrounding you that I will happily share when I'm clear enough about it to put it out in a paragraph or two; at its current state of distillation it'd take me 3 or 4 pages to describe, and I neither want to do that or to subject you to reading it. Not timely.

It does irritate me that, when we see a seal, I'm not in good enough shape to dive in and go play. True, they have absolutely rotten senses of humor, but I've been goosed before.

The nominal flirtee I had been dealing with had been asking for gas money to come visit, not gifts. So I sent 'her' (still not sure) a tank of gas worth, with specific and concrete instructions as to how to confirm to me that she was actually en route and at least resembling who she said she was before I would be willing to send any more. She promptly blew that off and asked for more anyway; I called the gas station she had said she was in front of and asked the proprietor if there was a blonde woman out front in a black Mustang, and she stuck her head out the door to take a look and came back and answered "No." Since my texting this fact to her late yesterday morning, she hasn't made any further effort to communicate.

If she had actually driven anywhere, I would have anticipated a furious effort to get more gas money, at least to get home. No communication at all seems to mean "Yeah, I was scamming you, and fifty bucks isn't worth your coming to Minnesota to chase me down." As the old cliche has it, if you loan a friend a few bucks and never see them again, it was well worth it.

I find human interaction costly, rewarding, and necessary. None of which implies I'm actually any *good* at it. Nor has practice been helpful, or at least not much. It seems a bit like caring for my damaged cardiac system; I can take good care of myself and get regular exercise and be as healthy as I can with what I've got, but I can't fix the fundamental issue and make it as good as I'd like it to be. So I do the best I can with what I've got.

Metaculture is a tool that I want to build because I have several purposes that require the application of such a tool to proceed. Conceptual tools are a pain in the ass, because unlike practical tools like shovels it's difficult to figure out when the handle's broken. I keep looking-for-but-not-finding a working colleague who would be willing to keep an eye on me and tell me when I seem to be trying to apply leverage without the appropriate lever. If I find one, I'll let you know.

*hugs*,

Joel

Sad about your cardiac issues - you don't talk about them much; I wasn't aware that oxygen-debt was a factor. Are you still traveling mostly by bicycle these days? Is that easier on you than walking?

LOL, nobody is in good enough shape to dive in and play with the seals here, unless they're wearing a drysuit. I do occasionally dive in, because I'm a Northern barbarian with a lot of natural insulation, but I dive out again just as fast, because sheesh, brrr!

Now I'm all curious about your quandary re me! LOL, reading 3 or 4 pages is not a problem for me; I read like lightning - it's my one-finger typing that's excruciatingly slow. But whenever you're ready to write it will be fine; curiosity keeps.

Very regrettable you got scammed like that. So she was (allegedly) going to drive from Minnesota to Portland? That sounds suspicious on the very face of it; very few women would be willing to travel that far to visit a guy they've never met, even if money wasn't a problem. I wonder how many other guys she's pulled that trick on? An expensive lesson, but less so than it might have been.

I think I am reasonably good at human interaction: a lot of folk seek my company and counsel, and I keep finding myself in leadership positions I didn't seek or particularly want ('Recurring Staff Infection'.) I don't think most humans - even those I love - are all that great at interacting with me, or even have a clue that there is an actual 'me' underneath the Passing Persona I habitually wear, or would have any interest in interacting with non-passing actual autistic 'me' if they did know.

My main difficulty with human interaction is in standing-down the frequent Red Alerts from having my boundaries trampled yet again - admittedly, I probably have more boundaries than many people do, but that is largely a consequence of having them trampled so often. When a 'Keep Out' sign doesn't work, one builds a fence; when the fence doesn't work, one builds a wall. I don't want walls, but I also don't want to be encroached on by rude invaders, so it's a continual balancing-act.

One huge factor - and I'll bet this is part of your quandary - is that I am nowhere near as 'female' as people presume. I pass as het/cis because the truth is far too complicated: there is no designation in the whole QUILTBAG that fits me.

So what are these purposes for which you would use metaculture as a tool, and what would using it look like re effects in the measurable world? LOL, as you may have noticed, over the years I have lost patience with abstractions and intellectualizations. Sheesh, particularly those that riff on 'quantum physics'! Having looked up David Deutsch, it seems to me that the only potential (not even 'probable' at this point) concrete result of his theories might be the building of a better computer - and why; for what? "One day it could be taxed by the Queen"...?

People who talk about quantum physics without understanding the math behind it are talking out they arses. This is why you won't catch me talking about it: I have enough familiarity with the field (and with physicists) to know how stupid I'd sound to someone who does understand it. Thus I'm not prepared to address Deutsch's ideas. I only note that he seems to get very mixed reviews from other quantum physicists.

Here's a review of The Beginning Of Infinity. It does look interesting - food for thought, no doubt - but one might not want to make a meal of it.

*hugs more* Later, dearheart; I'm off to the Wild again! Woot, such glorious weather! "What is so rare as a day in June?" Enjoy! ^^

Edited at 2017-06-11 08:44 pm (UTC)

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